Email: Password: Remember Me | Create Account (Free)

Back to Subject List

Old thread has been locked -- no new posts accepted in this thread
???
02/11/07 03:27
Read: times


 
#132501 - Age discrimination - why
Responding to: ???'s previous message
Richard Erlacher said:
Discrimination aganist seasoned workers exists more among those who lack a sound work ethic and functions against those who do have one.


Logically, that should apply to both young and old. The fact that it doesn't in practice says something else is in play here. FWIW, I think it's clear that older people are more likely to have a sound work ethic. Hell, I didn't develop one until my early 30's. So why do employers (Richard notwithstanding) discriminate against older engineers?

In my not so humble opinion, I think it's due to one factor. Young kids don't yet know the ropes; they fear for their jobs. No young engineer is going to tell his clueless boss that what he's asking for is an NP complete problem and therefore can't be done in the time constraints demanded. Even if the kid knows that it's mathematically provable, he knows his pointy-haired boss wouldn't understand the math, and he's not going to risk his job by telling him the truth.

So he lies, and comes up with that list of "reasons" why the job isn't done.

Older engineers aren't going to put up with that kind of stupidity. They are more likely to tell the dumb marketing dweeb that he's asking for 10 pounds to fit in a 5 pound bag, and it can't be done. Bosses don't like that!

Case in point: At one company I and other engineer were asked how long it would take to do a certain job. Our honest estimate was 6 months. Needless to say, the PHB found that unacceptable. So the other guy and I put our heads together and determined that if we burned the midnight oil continuously we could do it in 4 months.

The PHB accepted that, but then kept pulling us off the job to put out "forest fires". Little had been done on it until two weeks before the due date, when the PHB held a staff meeting to discuss the problem. Upon asking those involved (me, the other guy, and the VP of engineering) if we could pull it off, there was lots of hemming and hawing until it came to me. I told him straight out that we couldn't finish a 4 month job in 2 weeks.

I have never in my life seen such an unprofessional display as was put on by this clown who fancied himself a CEO. He literally banged his fist on the table and screamed.

I kept my job for a few years longer only because I was indispensable, but eventually I was outta there. I don't think it's a coincidence that the company folded a little over a year later.

The bottom line is that young kids, when faced with management stupidity, will bend over and spread 'em. Older guys will, although politely and logically, explain to the idiot that he is, well, an idiot. That pisses them off.




List of 149 messages in thread
TopicAuthorDate
oh and completely off topic but...            01/01/70 00:00      
   Everyone I know who\'s tried it, hates it            01/01/70 00:00      
      Careful now            01/01/70 00:00      
         half the time            01/01/70 00:00      
            They\'ll \"get the message\" ...            01/01/70 00:00      
               Linux, Mac's etc...            01/01/70 00:00      
                  You should still be able to get XP            01/01/70 00:00      
                     Retail...            01/01/70 00:00      
                        Yes            01/01/70 00:00      
                        Opps            01/01/70 00:00      
                        Good work            01/01/70 00:00      
                           Uhhh...            01/01/70 00:00      
                              We don't allow Apples, iPods, or cellphones            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 Sounds...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    My guys have a work ethic.            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       Dignity            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          Dignity means different things to different people            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             Jeff ...You're right but You forgot something ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             38            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                Ok, 38 going on 22            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                   Ecomomist            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                      This is evidence?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                         Works            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                            Old vs Young            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                               I all honesty re age            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                            Still no evidence            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                               The data            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                  Better...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                               Ok            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                  common knowledge            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                     are you sure it's Spanish....            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                        the written language is Spanish            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                     I don't agree            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                        The discrimination ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                           Age discrimination - why            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                              True            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                              experienced that one            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                     Yep            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                        I am sticking with my old system            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                        Mac            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                  it could go either way            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                  it is easy to learn a language            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                      we get more polite :)            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          I disagree, Rob            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             arbeit macht frei            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                You\'re right, in a sense...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                Bingo            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 Hmm            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    Offices vs cubes            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    When coding            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       no ... not quite ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          180            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             It keeps the riff-raff out            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                That metric...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       I worked once at a very "enlightened" company and            01/01/70 00:00      
         Yes, but I'm an old man ...            01/01/70 00:00      
   How to upgrade            01/01/70 00:00      
   Wait a little :)            01/01/70 00:00      
   is it?            01/01/70 00:00      
   Jumping the shark            01/01/70 00:00      
      Vista            01/01/70 00:00      
         Ref - Happy Days            01/01/70 00:00      
            Ahh            01/01/70 00:00      
         should it be \"Hasta la Vista\"?            01/01/70 00:00      
   a word to the Vista            01/01/70 00:00      
      Subtle humor?            01/01/70 00:00      
         No joke. It's an automatic forward            01/01/70 00:00      
            Unintended joke perhaps            01/01/70 00:00      
               it'll never stop 'till YOU stop buying Micro$oft            01/01/70 00:00      
                  wrong point            01/01/70 00:00      
                     Is it?            01/01/70 00:00      
                        Been theree            01/01/70 00:00      
                        Device programmers            01/01/70 00:00      
                           Device programmers            01/01/70 00:00      
                              Exactly            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 Huh?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    at least the LINUX stuff is tested ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       Irony Strikes Again            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          I\'m going blind, I guess ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       the fruit basket again            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          Xilinx software testing            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             Xilinx            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                lucky you            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                   IC makers tools            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                      They hire software weenies to test it, if at all            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                Xilinx support            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             I agree completely, Andy            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    In the last year?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       Decent WIndows Accounting            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          Agreed            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    oh no, not again            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       It doesn't stop the complainers            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          Maybe...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          bug reports            01/01/70 00:00      
                              whoi on earth has time for that?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 SDCC            01/01/70 00:00      
   such as            01/01/70 00:00      
      such as this            01/01/70 00:00      
         get a life            01/01/70 00:00      
            No need to reply            01/01/70 00:00      
               religious fanatism seems to permeate the            01/01/70 00:00      
                  It\'s FANATICISM, Erik            01/01/70 00:00      
      or as            01/01/70 00:00      
         how would that fix a compiler bug?            01/01/70 00:00      
            If someone complains ...            01/01/70 00:00      
               I wish them the very best            01/01/70 00:00      
            Define violence            01/01/70 00:00      
               OK, I'll define            01/01/70 00:00      
                  Ok...            01/01/70 00:00      
                     Hit the nail on the head            01/01/70 00:00      
                        Open-source products are generated for cause            01/01/70 00:00      
                        Please...            01/01/70 00:00      
                           On deaf ears            01/01/70 00:00      
                              Commercial software            01/01/70 00:00      
                              If I make a product that behaves exatly like my co            01/01/70 00:00      
                              Minix            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 I'd like to know, as I do not remember the details            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    The SCO case            01/01/70 00:00      
                           Spades aren't diamonds, and there's nothing free            01/01/70 00:00      
                              Monopoly ideas behind patents and copyrights.            01/01/70 00:00      
                              IP            01/01/70 00:00      
                              The deal is...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 Steve, Rob & Lynn            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    Free            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       I dont' understant...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 Copyrights            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    But what if you die soon after getting a copyright            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       van den            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          "from the"            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             In NL, anything above the sea level is Berg... :-)            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                LOL!            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                   Above sea level ?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                      about 60% or so ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                         they beat us            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                         Prove it !            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                            Mountain            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                         Mountains :)            01/01/70 00:00      
   is that where this comes from            01/01/70 00:00      
   32-bit Vista            01/01/70 00:00      
      Have you tried ...            01/01/70 00:00      
         Deja Vu            01/01/70 00:00      
            use the boat anchor approach            01/01/70 00:00      
   XP available if you know where to go            01/01/70 00:00      
      thats where ebay and similar come in handy            01/01/70 00:00      
      Vista doesnt support many DOS programs            01/01/70 00:00      
         don't you get it?            01/01/70 00:00      
         Virtualize, or emulate.            01/01/70 00:00      
            dosemu for linux            01/01/70 00:00      
         Virtual PC            01/01/70 00:00      

Back to Subject List