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???
11/05/06 19:48
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#127395 - What are you talking about
Responding to: ???'s previous message
Richard Erlacher said:
If you want information about this board, it's very scanty. There is no schematic, no documentation that's directly applicable to this board at all, and a 2004 (very much outdated) book on programmable logic that may be helpful in using Digilent's pre-2004 boards and XILINX's products of that era.

Absolutely Wrong.

Schematic (2006 release):
http://www.xilinx.com/bvdocs/ip...al_sch.pdf

164 page User Guide:
http://www.xilinx.com/bvdocs/userguides/ug230.pdf

17 reference designs:
http://www.xilinx.com/products/...esigns.htm

Board layout:
http://www.xilinx.com/products/...erbers.pdf

Richard Erlacher said:
The FPGA boards I have lack sufficient on-board PROM, with one exception, to utilize the FPGA fully. This tendency seems to have been continued.

Wrong yet again. The configuration bitstream size for a design is completely independent of the design's complexity for a given FPGA. A design using a single AND gate has the same bitstream size as a design for a vector processor. There is NO way for a design to only partially use an FPGA, the entire configuration must fit in the PROM. Plus you obviously have never used this board since it contains an XC04FS platform flash. Said memory has 4 Mbits of space, while a XC3S500E needs only 2.2 MBits of space to hold its configuration data. Thus this board actually has nearly twice as much configuration memory as it actually needs, and that memory I believe is available to the user as general purpose storage if you specify that the configuration pins become user IO after configuration has completed.

Richard Erlacher said:
It uses a rather fragile 100-pin Hirose FX2 plug connector that are incompatible with conventional ribbon cables for purpose of connecting to off-board circuitry.

That connector is anything but fragile and is compatible with any standard 0.1" male header. In fact, with a gender bender, this FPGA board becomes pin for pin compatible with both of these expansion boards:

http://www.digilentinc.com/Products/...=Accessory
http://www.digilentinc.com/Products/...=Accessory

Richard Erlacher said:
My kit came with an outdated ISEv8.1 (They're on 8.2 with SP3 by now, and I've only had the board about four months. They don't have the software working right (as well as earlier versions) yet, either.)

Irrelevant since this FPGA is supported by Xilinx's free webpack software which provides 99% of the same basic functionality as its $2000 full ISE Foundation counterpart.

Richard Erlacher said:
The FPGA boards came with programming cables that adapted the parallel port to the board's JTAG connector.

Those cables are awful and should never be used as any nearby noise will cause them to screw up. Only use Xilinx programming cables as they are superior to anything else available (though they cost $150 which is why this board is so great since that $150 circuit is built into the board itself).

Richard Erlacher said:
to facilitate operation of the device as a host for MicroBlaze soft-core and running LINUX

Who in their right mind runs a LINUX OS on a soft processor core in a 500,000 gate FPGA. Maybe on a much bigger, faster FPGA with built in PowerPCs but not this one.

List of 81 messages in thread
TopicAuthorDate
Getting Started With FPGAs            01/01/70 00:00      
   A Book            01/01/70 00:00      
   Proceed with caution!            01/01/70 00:00      
   This is quite a nice deveolpment board            01/01/70 00:00      
   I like this board            01/01/70 00:00      
      I\'ve got one of these and can\'t recommend it            01/01/70 00:00      
         What are you talking about            01/01/70 00:00      
            Let me explain ...            01/01/70 00:00      
   generaly speaking            01/01/70 00:00      
      Damn, Jez, you need a spell-checker!            01/01/70 00:00      
         HDL-based design needs TEST BENCHES            01/01/70 00:00      
            I use 'em all the time, but ...            01/01/70 00:00      
               If your design is so simple            01/01/70 00:00      
                  What\'s important is the entry effort            01/01/70 00:00      
                     I dunno where you get these ideas from Richard            01/01/70 00:00      
                        Can you say ModelSim?            01/01/70 00:00      
                     Wrong            01/01/70 00:00      
                        Well, the schematic needs a little work            01/01/70 00:00      
                           more work?            01/01/70 00:00      
                              a few points ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                           ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                     HDL vs Schematics, take 1E6            01/01/70 00:00      
                        Thta may be great comfort to you ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                           Schematics? You're kidding!            01/01/70 00:00      
                              No, nor is my customer.            01/01/70 00:00      
                              both are a 'representation of Boole'            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 Yep, you're right...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    To Clarify            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       schematic as equivalence check            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          Manual verification impossible because ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             schematic verification            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       Some more clarification            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          hanging problem            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             so will your post be            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    it's not fear of the unknown, but fear of its cost            01/01/70 00:00      
                           Static Timing Analysis and those "young engineers"            01/01/70 00:00      
                              It's a sign of the times, I suppose            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 And times change            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 senior?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    That's because you've been avoiding the subject            01/01/70 00:00      
            I agree entirely. test benches are a pain but            01/01/70 00:00      
   Update from the OP            01/01/70 00:00      
      It's true ... we see things differently            01/01/70 00:00      
      the first buuk for any such venture            01/01/70 00:00      
      FPGA boards and that Cypress book            01/01/70 00:00      
         This may answer your question(s)            01/01/70 00:00      
   some of the references in the fpga faq            01/01/70 00:00      
      Good attitude            01/01/70 00:00      
   Also remeber to look at webistes like www.xilinx.c            01/01/70 00:00      
   My recommendation and opinions            01/01/70 00:00      
      I would stay away from Virtex-II            01/01/70 00:00      
         If you're going to fiddle with the 805x core ...            01/01/70 00:00      
            Something about life-cycles            01/01/70 00:00      
               No doubt about it.            01/01/70 00:00      
                  useful work            01/01/70 00:00      
                     Well, I beg to differ.            01/01/70 00:00      
                        salient point            01/01/70 00:00      
                           There's an area where that's not necessarily true            01/01/70 00:00      
                           FPGA Editor            01/01/70 00:00      
            Not necessarily            01/01/70 00:00      
               It's still too costly            01/01/70 00:00      
   Thanks to all            01/01/70 00:00      
   Update #2 from the OP            01/01/70 00:00      
   A testbench is...            01/01/70 00:00      
      I C            01/01/70 00:00      
         test bench            01/01/70 00:00      
            Makes sense            01/01/70 00:00      
   Yeah but...            01/01/70 00:00      
   Tristate buffer with propagation delays            01/01/70 00:00      
   Schematics vs. HDL            01/01/70 00:00      
      In a nutshell            01/01/70 00:00      
         it\'s been a while            01/01/70 00:00      
      Yes, but ... and there's always a but ...            01/01/70 00:00      
   Yep you can its called gate level design            01/01/70 00:00      
   Its really nothing to do with showing off            01/01/70 00:00      
      did you paraphrase this?            01/01/70 00:00      
      Jez, It\'s not \"sea of gates\" design, you know ...            01/01/70 00:00      
         Richards, it is there philosophy            01/01/70 00:00      
         Viewlogic            01/01/70 00:00      
   it is true            01/01/70 00:00      
   Here you go Richard graphical design exploration            01/01/70 00:00      

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