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???
05/06/09 08:26
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#165099 - That was my take too
Responding to: ???'s previous message
Yes, architecture changes means that an implementation can take 5 clock cycles for one instruction and 1 for another, or in some situations run two instructions concurrently, making it look like the second instruction took zero clock cycles. So when moving between different cores, it isn't possible to just care about number of NOP/s at a given clock frequency. The real speed improvement will depend on the instruction mix and may scale significantly differently at a different instruction mix.

What make this interesting is that the original claim is "8.1 times faster than standard 80C51 at the same frequency", which means that we are not talking about a DT8051 at top speed being 8.1 times faster than a 12MHz 12-clocker. We are talking about a DT8051 clocked at 12MHz being 8.1 times faster. The 8.1 will increase when the DT8051 core is run at more than 12Mhz. And the factor 8.1 will decrease if you replace a 12MHz 12-clocker with a 33MHz 12-clocker.

In short, the claim is that the DT8051 has improved the (averaged) instruction efficiency for a specific benchmark with 8.1 times at the same clock frequency.

So, yes, I agree with you that the factor 8.1x in this case does not depend on CLK frequency but is a fixed efficiency factor, and only applicable when running a specific sequence of 8051 instructions. The fractional part of 8.1 gives a clear indication that it is not a computation simplified down to just NOP instructions, in which case we would have expected a figre 2, 3, 4, 6, 12, 24 (superscalar two-at-a-time processing)) or similar.

That is the reason why I wonder about the origin of the claim in Richards post, that it would take 300MHz for the DT8051 to match any 25MHz 1-clocker.

List of 74 messages in thread
TopicAuthorDate
max clk freq            01/01/70 00:00      
   Which            01/01/70 00:00      
   300MHz            01/01/70 00:00      
      .            01/01/70 00:00      
         Does that make it effectively 600MHz, then...?            01/01/70 00:00      
            That are the links I found...            01/01/70 00:00      
               Interesting item, but did you notice ... ?            01/01/70 00:00      
                  300Mips, equivalent to 3.6GHz!            01/01/70 00:00      
                     That's slightly misleading ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                        You sure about your math?            01/01/70 00:00      
                           It's confusing ... typical marketing drivel            01/01/70 00:00      
                              Based on the claims you posted            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 Those aren't my claims!            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    Read comments _before_ (not) answering them            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       Architecture speed            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          That was my take too            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             Of course, it does not depend on CLK frequency!            01/01/70 00:00      
                              I cannot see a confusion            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 Not all one-clocker mfg's make the same claims            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    But...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 comparison of 12- and less-clockers            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    Very nice!            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    Cool!            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    Good overview            01/01/70 00:00      
               Another link            01/01/70 00:00      
                  Dhrystone?            01/01/70 00:00      
                     Yes ... one could argue that the core is hobbled            01/01/70 00:00      
                        to sell IS useful... ;-)            01/01/70 00:00      
                     Dhrystone            01/01/70 00:00      
                        give data            01/01/70 00:00      
                  I find it useful...            01/01/70 00:00      
                     Nonsense            01/01/70 00:00      
                        Nice attitude...            01/01/70 00:00      
                        One thing that would be useful for FPGA            01/01/70 00:00      
                           Still waiting            01/01/70 00:00      
                              Here it is ... It's simple arithmetic            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 Not at all!            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 You missed the "at the same frequency" part            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    You're right, in a sense ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       Still thinking of the DT8051 as 12-clocker            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          Gee ... I can see where I went off the track!            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             You deserve respect for that...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             Very easy to miss things            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                It is a shame the documentation is so superficial            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             Marketing demagogy            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                baloney            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                   Insignificant?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                      the "classical" timing            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                         Fair claim            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                Not so fast, there, Pilgrim...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                   Any alternative?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                      Possibly ... ???            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                         Still pipelining            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                            It doesn't have to pipeline            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                               What use?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                  if critical, lock - if you can            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                     What question?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                        Whatever happened to Amit Mittal ?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                           maximum speed of a car            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                           Pigeon Poster?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                        no question, uncernity            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                  It's not that difficult ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                     Are we talking about the same thing?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                        It is a matter of how you choose to view things            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                           Q still open: any 8051 with only two clock transitions?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                              I do not believe bigger is better ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                 You argue quite much for not caring            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                    Without going into too much detail ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                       Pipeline for concurrency            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                          One step at a time            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                             Many steps at the same time            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                              1-clocker without pipelining            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                 Interesting link - I just wish it was a bit meatier            01/01/70 00:00      
   what the datasheet for the particular device states            01/01/70 00:00      

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