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???
01/24/08 06:49
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#149897 - And not for the better
Responding to: ???'s previous message
David Gal said:
95% is an educated guess.

An educated guess is valid, but it's not a guarantee. I don't think the situation is nearly as bad as Dewar implies.

Having said that, education in America is definitely declining. IMHO that's by design, but that's another topic and I don't want to go off on a tangent.

I currently teach at my alma mater, and due to being the new guy and my lack of a PhD, I get stuck with teaching algebra. This is math I learned in junior high school, and I'm teaching it to college students who somehow graduated high school without basic math skills. That's a definite downward trend.

I can say that at least 10 universities (with presumably prestigious reputations) Java is taught without fail as the intro course.

The language used isn't an issue. All Turing complete languages are conceptually equal. I'm not at all fond of Java, but concepts and principles can be taught as well with Java as with any other language. If universities are not teaching the basics, that's the fault of the universities, not a fault of the language they choose.

If at least 10 of the "top 20" school are doing it, you can bet that the rest are as well.

Unjustified assumption. Several of the top universities are doing an excellent job. That's why so many foreign students come to the US to get their CS degrees.

Here's my informal, not guaranteed, assessment: While the top students in other countries are easily the match for the top students in the US, the average CS graduate in the US can beat the pants off the average CS graduate in India, Japan, or whatever country you choose.

WOW!!! That's quite the math requirement! No way is that true today. I think 1 discrete math class is recommended in general (though not required) and one linear algebra class is required. Multi var calc is without question not a requirement as is finite math, stats, probability, etc. Damn, no wonder the older guys are so smart :)

We're not any smarter than anyone else, just better educated than the young ones. I worked with engineers who earned their degrees in the 50's and 60's (not CS--CS degrees didn't exist then) who were much more knowledgeable than I. There's a downward trend in education, but I don't think it's as bad as Dewar seems to think--yet.



List of 34 messages in thread
TopicAuthorDate
finally somebody said it...            01/01/70 00:00      
   Its not actualy the problem            01/01/70 00:00      
   well why don't they ...            01/01/70 00:00      
   They are not equivalent            01/01/70 00:00      
      To some extent            01/01/70 00:00      
   Dewar not in this universe            01/01/70 00:00      
      Wrong...            01/01/70 00:00      
         Possibly            01/01/70 00:00      
            wow, things have changed            01/01/70 00:00      
               And not for the better            01/01/70 00:00      
                  a correlation to Davids arguments            01/01/70 00:00      
                     What's wrong with Java on '51?            01/01/70 00:00      
                        the more portability the more you pay            01/01/70 00:00      
                           Hehe            01/01/70 00:00      
                              naah            01/01/70 00:00      
                              from all my Lunux experience straightly follows...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 not a flame, just some thoughts as to why            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    Not a flame either, just some facts            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       Jeff, why did you bypass the original issue            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          I didn't            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             is that what you clean between the teeth with?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                FOSS            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             not as much 'share' as market            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             Hmmm            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                Applications            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                   the two above, Carig/Jeff ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                      Yes, they'll ask questions like ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                         Power-Point Platform            01/01/70 00:00      
                           this was the point I tried to make            01/01/70 00:00      
   Don't despair            01/01/70 00:00      
   Fully Agree With Eric and that guy            01/01/70 00:00      
      a correlation to Eskos post            01/01/70 00:00      
      Poor education all across the board            01/01/70 00:00      
         Is basic IT education needed ?            01/01/70 00:00      

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