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???
08/25/10 04:56
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#178301 - You're right on target
Responding to: ???'s previous message
As you've said, you have to pin-swap, etc, where possible. Since I sell the IP, however, I do want the CPLD's and FPGA's to be the place where the signals are defined. In those cases where I provide the devices, complete with labels, I have to have my own guy do the layout so that pin swapping where necessary and practical is possible. That's seldom the case with CPLD's, but with FPGA's a pin swap can affect timing. That's why you wrote, in a previous post, that it's important which logic blocks contain which signals.

That, also, is another reason why the bEAGLE stuff is such rubbish. When I have to change the pinout, I always have to back-annotate the schematic, but I dislike very much having to change the package spec as well as the symbol. It's much smarter to have the signals associated with the schematic and not also with the library symbol. If I pin-swap an address or data pair on a RAM, for example, which has little consequence of any sort, I simply assign the signals on the schematic. It's simple in the old OrCAD package, simply because I have to assign the package once and be done with it. If I change from a 0.600" (32DIP600) to a "skinny" dip, however, I have to reassign the package association to the library's 32DIP300 on the schematic, and the netlister picks it up as the data is transferred to the layout tool. In bEAGLE ... well, it's a different story. The result is that the board may ultimately contain several different versions of any one package, owing to the fact that each schematic symbol has to be associated with a package outline graphic, even though they could, and should, all be the same. Yes, proper management would ensure that they are, but over time things get changed, and in the interest of expediency, people "forget" to make it global.

As I've said, the process is adequate for a one-man shop, but if you have a team, the process breaks down because the layout guy doesn't have to sign the schematic, and the circuit designer doesn't, in all cases, have to take ownership of the layout.

RE



List of 122 messages in thread
TopicAuthorDate
Free PCB design software...            01/01/70 00:00      
   re: Designspark            01/01/70 00:00      
      Yes, indeed.            01/01/70 00:00      
         RS vs Farnell            01/01/70 00:00      
            RE:            01/01/70 00:00      
               EEEEEK!!            01/01/70 00:00      
                  re: EEEEEK!!            01/01/70 00:00      
                     Well, now ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                        Wrong.            01/01/70 00:00      
                           It depends on where the data originated            01/01/70 00:00      
                           I'm not sure I get what you mean            01/01/70 00:00      
                              Sorry...            01/01/70 00:00      
                        Richard!!!            01/01/70 00:00      
                           did I say that?            01/01/70 00:00      
                              Yes            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 Hard to explain ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    Still no explanation to the "answer is wrong" vote            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       wasn't me, just curious            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          Richards            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       Ehh???            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       This site isn't equipped, and perhaps properly so ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          Linked in previous post by me            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             Yes, I got that ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          which is why            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             Re: Italics            01/01/70 00:00      
                           Yep! It must 'ave been the whiskey ...            01/01/70 00:00      
               But...            01/01/70 00:00      
                  Evaluation            01/01/70 00:00      
                     fortunately, many small projects can be "free"            01/01/70 00:00      
                     Oh.            01/01/70 00:00      
                        Maybe the rotate contents of upper-left box            01/01/70 00:00      
   took a peek and ...            01/01/70 00:00      
      Try...            01/01/70 00:00      
         looks good, what's the catch            01/01/70 00:00      
            Not Farnell!            01/01/70 00:00      
               can live with that and whats that            01/01/70 00:00      
                  Rebranded            01/01/70 00:00      
   One thing to keep in mind ...            01/01/70 00:00      
      This is *not* Eagle!            01/01/70 00:00      
         EasyPC            01/01/70 00:00      
            Is it true, then?            01/01/70 00:00      
         I'm merely pointing out ...            01/01/70 00:00      
            Errrm.            01/01/70 00:00      
               Maybe, but why would you switch then?            01/01/70 00:00      
                  Because...            01/01/70 00:00      
                     Yes, and that's really the only "good" version            01/01/70 00:00      
            Of course it is!            01/01/70 00:00      
               Well, my complaint is ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                  gentlemen, PLEASE            01/01/70 00:00      
                  EDA tools component libraries            01/01/70 00:00      
                     It's just not worth the bother ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                        per-design CPLD/FPGA symbols            01/01/70 00:00      
                           Ouch.            01/01/70 00:00      
                              Some companies likes few customers but large bills            01/01/70 00:00      
                              re: Ouch            01/01/70 00:00      
                           You're right on target            01/01/70 00:00      
                              FPGA pin swapping            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 What I've found ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                  Changing packages            01/01/70 00:00      
                     Depends on the number of pins, doesn't it?            01/01/70 00:00      
                        Because...            01/01/70 00:00      
                           In one of these posts ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                              Oh, Richard!            01/01/70 00:00      
   Thanks            01/01/70 00:00      
   demo??            01/01/70 00:00      
      Great...seems free..            01/01/70 00:00      
         Yes, it is Free            01/01/70 00:00      
            Free but..................            01/01/70 00:00      
               No, that's not true            01/01/70 00:00      
   Richard - is this where you're getting confused?            01/01/70 00:00      
      Isn't RS just another vendor?            01/01/70 00:00      
         Whatever happened to your principle...            01/01/70 00:00      
            Isn't this about free PCB software?            01/01/70 00:00      
               It was about a certain *specific* software            01/01/70 00:00      
                  Perhaps, but my point was ...            01/01/70 00:00      
      But subject line seems to indicate all free software            01/01/70 00:00      
         I'm just a little p*ssed off ... since it cost $1500 ...            01/01/70 00:00      
            Definitely penalty box            01/01/70 00:00      
               Had we not been "sucked in" by the "free" version ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                  How did you not notice??            01/01/70 00:00      
                  So you don't like Eagle-CAD - we have got the point            01/01/70 00:00      
                     Maybe Richard knows what he wants            01/01/70 00:00      
                        Dislike doesn't mean a product is worth zero            01/01/70 00:00      
                           Software is supposed to increase productivity            01/01/70 00:00      
                              So - you taping your boards?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 Nope ... I don't do that either            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    Still bogus claim            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       Keep in mind what I do for a living            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          Now that *is* a good idea            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             Price of bandwidth - or simplicity of use            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                Viewing Schematics and Diagrams            01/01/70 00:00      
                           Software is not a car.            01/01/70 00:00      
                              Eagle            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 re: Eagle            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 Hobbyists like it because it's cheap, not because it's good            01/01/70 00:00      
                        The choice often isn't mine            01/01/70 00:00      
                           I gotta say, why haven't you told the makers?            01/01/70 00:00      
                              You think I was silent about that?            01/01/70 00:00      
   About DesignSpark PCB ...            01/01/70 00:00      
      EasyPC.            01/01/70 00:00      
         Autorouters            01/01/70 00:00      
            re: Autorouters            01/01/70 00:00      
         RE: Andy says            01/01/70 00:00      
            Andy Says ...            01/01/70 00:00      
               RE: Your "real" software            01/01/70 00:00      
                  "Real" Software            01/01/70 00:00      
      Has anyone worked with the schematic editor?            01/01/70 00:00      
   not related but.....            01/01/70 00:00      
      Placement            01/01/70 00:00      
         autorouter            01/01/70 00:00      
            autorouter - placing parts on both sides of the board            01/01/70 00:00      
               This looks like a classic example...            01/01/70 00:00      
                  And another thing...            01/01/70 00:00      
               Colour??            01/01/70 00:00      
                  It depends - RTFM            01/01/70 00:00      
                  Color of pads depends on surface mount or PTH components            01/01/70 00:00      
                  Layers            01/01/70 00:00      
                     got the point...            01/01/70 00:00      
   At Design Spark            01/01/70 00:00      
      There's a forum for that!            01/01/70 00:00      
      There's a Menu for that            01/01/70 00:00      
         OK..            01/01/70 00:00      

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