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???
10/28/11 13:51
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#184407 - ramblings
Responding to: ???'s previous message
1) I know of no thread mentioning evals that has not got Richard on his soapbox.
Richard: for serious eval you 'borrow' a full version from the toolmaker the 'eval' version is for those that are "marginal customers" and what I see, today, mainly used for inclusion in chip demo packages.

As far as I know, there are no 8051s that use caches.
incorrect, the SILabs '51s do

All the same, most efficiency is gained by improvements in the algorithm rather than the low level ASM code.
absolutrly

Of course, you will get the best performance from a perfectly designed ASM program. Very few applications are that time critical. If your clients have few boards, your development time is very significant.
the issue is that you MAY need to "get the best performance from a perfectly designed ASM" from some little loop, never from the whole shebang. "Crafting" e.g. a user interface (timing = human reaction) is ridiculous.

I am sure that you can knock out perfect ASM faster and more reliably than others can use a HLL. This is due to your experience. At your age, I expect that PDIP-40 8051 chips will see you through. A young student would better spend her time learning how to use MCUs and tools that have a realistic future.
I feel for the "young student" in my time the chips have gotten smaller synchrounous with my eyes getting weaker and the "young students" starting point does not bode well for his abilities to scope when he get older.

Incidentally, when you meet your bus or jealous husband, will your clients really be able to maintain your ASM code? Or even find another expert?
this is the REAL issue, one client of mine chose to use a more expensive chip with the remark "this little bit of ASM is a great ides, but I need to be sure someone can maintain the thing in the future, so use C only"

Erik

List of 53 messages in thread
TopicAuthorDate
Linking C programs with Keil evaluation            01/01/70 00:00      
   Eval Tools.            01/01/70 00:00      
      That makes sense            01/01/70 00:00      
         It's not that much more useable            01/01/70 00:00      
            Work-around for evaluation version limitations?            01/01/70 00:00      
            Marked -1            01/01/70 00:00      
               I'm not so sure you're right here ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                  Irrelevant if people have ideas - should they be debated?            01/01/70 00:00      
                     There's a reason I haven't done it ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                        Would not represent a valid evaluation            01/01/70 00:00      
                           Wait a minute ... You've got this wrong ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                     One question            01/01/70 00:00      
                        What about the guy who simply wants to evaluate the product?            01/01/70 00:00      
                           sometimes coding situations and requirements differ            01/01/70 00:00      
                        How would you like it?            01/01/70 00:00      
                           That's not what I'm asking them to do            01/01/70 00:00      
                              A message from the OP.            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 I don't supply the compiler ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                        Wrong view on evaluation tools            01/01/70 00:00      
                           as I've said before, where you sit determines what you see            01/01/70 00:00      
                              Still failing to recognize reason for hole in code map            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 You missed my point again            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    Simulate or use Logic Analyser            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       ramblings            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       Using evaluation software and hardware            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          The above would be true if....            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             You don't seriously believe that, do you?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                A thief is a thief            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                   Indeed...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                   FIrst of all, I don't advocate theivery            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                      and more mumbo jumbo in the reply            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                      Can _you_ not read debugger output?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          8255            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             Yes, but they're still shipped on some 805x trainer boards            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             Just sayin'            01/01/70 00:00      
                  Square Wheels for the Car            01/01/70 00:00      
                     I disagree ... not that that should surprise anyone            01/01/70 00:00      
                        eval and evaluation            01/01/70 00:00      
                           Yes, if only they were useful ...            01/01/70 00:00      
      Also "LPC900 Studio"            01/01/70 00:00      
         They all seem crippled            01/01/70 00:00      
            comments            01/01/70 00:00      
            They all seem crippled            01/01/70 00:00      
               Yes ... SDCC ... the obvious solution            01/01/70 00:00      
                  what's obvious about it            01/01/70 00:00      
                     Why not?            01/01/70 00:00      
                        reasons            01/01/70 00:00      
                           Unfortunately            01/01/70 00:00      
                              re Keil            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 15 years ago?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    OK, maybe not            01/01/70 00:00      
            reasonable price            01/01/70 00:00      
            raisonance is 4k with no code offset            01/01/70 00:00      

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