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???
05/01/07 17:44
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 		 #138401 - Oh ok
Responding to: ???'s previous message
Craig Steiner said:
Huh? What makes me "so important?" Nothing. Did I say I was important? No, I didn't. My opinion on this matter is no more or less important than yours, but you seem to have no qualms about sharing your opinions. Is there some reason I shouldn't do the same? I'm sorry. Based on the above comment alone, I think I just "won" the exchange.


Richard Erlacher said:
Based on your prior comments, one might conclude that you consider yourself above the "deer and antelope" in importance and, for that matter, above all other humans present and future as well.


Ah, I misunderstood you. Yes, I think that I and every other human being on this planet is more important than deer and antelope. No, I don't think I'm more important than any other human being, present or future.

Craig Steiner said:
I don't have 100 stamps in my passport. But the stamps that I do have are more than enough to tell me you're completely out in left field on this one.


Richard Erlacher said:
If you're referring to your time in Mexico, you should probably consider that you were not part of the "mainstream" with 1000x the typical net worth of the citizenry.


You lost me there.

Corruption here (I happen to be on business in Mexico so "here" is Mexico right now) effects everyone at all levels. Not just the rich, not just the poor. Everyone complains about it and no-one can do anything about it. It´s systemic and pervasive. You don't escape it because you're rich. Net worth has nothing to do with it--though if you have a higher net worth, you'll be expected to pony up more for the bribe because you can afford it.

Craig Steiner said:
Richard, I think you expect and look for the worst in everything, and that's exactly what you find--real or imagined.


Richard Erlacher said:
I only expect humans to be as they are, which is incapable of doing "good" for the planet.


The planet is a rock in space and it will continue to be a rock in space no matter what we do. I know "pet rocks" were a popular fad for awhile, but no-one was forced to buy a pet rock if they didn't want to. Now the environmentalists want us to treat this rock like it was something other than a rock.

I'm more concerned about people doing good for other people, and that's something I do see often in every country I've been in.

Regards,
Craig Steiner


List of 346 messages in thread
TopicAuthorDate
I was talking to someone today            01/01/70 00:00      
   Man-made global warming            01/01/70 00:00      
      Nonetheless            01/01/70 00:00      
         Arthur C Clarke            01/01/70 00:00      
            since Richard misunderstood me            01/01/70 00:00      
               it is clean, safe and zero emissions            01/01/70 00:00      
                  It implies distribution of electric power ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                     You dismiss this further down...            01/01/70 00:00      
                        Yes, but your presentation is irrelevant!            01/01/70 00:00      
                           Prove it.            01/01/70 00:00      
                              It\'s obvious!            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 Anybody need a coach for their debate team?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    Well, Rob, YOU voted for him, didn\'t you?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       Huh?            01/01/70 00:00      
                  Zero Emission mythos            01/01/70 00:00      
                     you missed the biggie            01/01/70 00:00      
                        Touché!            01/01/70 00:00      
                        That wouldn't be an issue if it were done right!            01/01/70 00:00      
                           Business Electric Rates            01/01/70 00:00      
                              Good for them!            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 BALONEY made from horsefeathers            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 What courage?            01/01/70 00:00      
                     No ... the batteries will be lithium types            01/01/70 00:00      
                        Not enough lithium            01/01/70 00:00      
                           Wikipedia for one            01/01/70 00:00      
                              65 ppm?            01/01/70 00:00      
         Elaborate            01/01/70 00:00      
            the real solution ...            01/01/70 00:00      
               You can see the weather changing its true            01/01/70 00:00      
               What an excellent idea!            01/01/70 00:00      
                  You'll probably get your wish, but why rush it?            01/01/70 00:00      
            Stewardship            01/01/70 00:00      
               Stewardship            01/01/70 00:00      
                  Basic point.            01/01/70 00:00      
                     Basic counterpoint            01/01/70 00:00      
                        Says who ?            01/01/70 00:00      
                        ... so you WOULD defaecate in your living room?            01/01/70 00:00      
                           I do not know if this modern convenience called a            01/01/70 00:00      
                  I think the real problem is ...free hot water            01/01/70 00:00      
                     hot hot heat            01/01/70 00:00      
                     Some people heat their houses with that hot water!            01/01/70 00:00      
                        In Reykjavik, Iceland, they all, do.            01/01/70 00:00      
                  Stewardship\'s for somebody else, right?            01/01/70 00:00      
         CO2            01/01/70 00:00      
            Dosis sola venenum fecit.            01/01/70 00:00      
               SIze isn't everything            01/01/70 00:00      
            What about cyanide in your drinking water?            01/01/70 00:00      
      Degrees.            01/01/70 00:00      
         Sources please.            01/01/70 00:00      
            Sure, but ...            01/01/70 00:00      
               Excellent references            01/01/70 00:00      
                  Historic data.            01/01/70 00:00      
                     Historical scales            01/01/70 00:00      
                        is THIS a reason?            01/01/70 00:00      
                           what emit the most CO2?            01/01/70 00:00      
                              on a similar tone...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 what do you prefer?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    more emissions            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    I use both            01/01/70 00:00      
                           Yes, it is a reason            01/01/70 00:00      
                           Wrong Pollutants            01/01/70 00:00      
                              perfectly good reason to expunge the offender            01/01/70 00:00      
                           there's another issue ... the elephant in the room            01/01/70 00:00      
                              What ?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 It's a balance issue ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    Come on            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    Planck's law...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       And            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          Oops!            01/01/70 00:00      
      If it's concensus, it isn't spelled correctly!            01/01/70 00:00      
   Regardless of the source, if it's a problem            01/01/70 00:00      
      to be honest...            01/01/70 00:00      
         When I was a boy ...            01/01/70 00:00      
            Whatever            01/01/70 00:00      
               Ice Age?            01/01/70 00:00      
                  Not that hot yet            01/01/70 00:00      
            Now I'm confused.            01/01/70 00:00      
               Take your pick ...            01/01/70 00:00      
      The Big Ball in The SKY            01/01/70 00:00      
         Gonna get warmer, with or without us            01/01/70 00:00      
            Sunspot.            01/01/70 00:00      
               I rest my case.            01/01/70 00:00      
            Visiting            01/01/70 00:00      
   It's all about $$$$$$$$            01/01/70 00:00      
      Can you provide even one example?            01/01/70 00:00      
         Intuition            01/01/70 00:00      
            the truth tends to be in the middle            01/01/70 00:00      
               Yes it can hurt.            01/01/70 00:00      
                  For those interested.... a good website            01/01/70 00:00      
                     and a good video            01/01/70 00:00      
                  (OT): I don't understand...            01/01/70 00:00      
                     Complete backfire            01/01/70 00:00      
                        Ah, so....            01/01/70 00:00      
            Perhaps, but also ...            01/01/70 00:00      
               More like the kettle calling the pot a pot.            01/01/70 00:00      
                  let us get a few things straight ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                     Oh sigh            01/01/70 00:00      
                        vhemt.org            01/01/70 00:00      
                           Density            01/01/70 00:00      
                  Evidence            01/01/70 00:00      
                     "scientific" evidence            01/01/70 00:00      
                        You know what evidence is            01/01/70 00:00      
                           If you want            01/01/70 00:00      
                           Note that "wackos" is spelled correctly!            01/01/70 00:00      
         Yes            01/01/70 00:00      
            No            01/01/70 00:00      
            under the influence            01/01/70 00:00      
               Percentage vs Absolute Value            01/01/70 00:00      
                  That\'s the point            01/01/70 00:00      
                     Richard, do you even trust yourself?            01/01/70 00:00      
                        I don't know whom to trust ... perhaps nobody            01/01/70 00:00      
         One example            01/01/70 00:00      
            the converse            01/01/70 00:00      
            Horsefeathers!            01/01/70 00:00      
      and power            01/01/70 00:00      
         Mmh, I'd like to see some sources.            01/01/70 00:00      
            Wate vapor            01/01/70 00:00      
               proportions again            01/01/70 00:00      
                  Whatever            01/01/70 00:00      
                     Acute vs. chronic.            01/01/70 00:00      
               Differences.            01/01/70 00:00      
                  Strange            01/01/70 00:00      
                     H20 vs. CH4 vs. CO2.            01/01/70 00:00      
                        Since you like to type...            01/01/70 00:00      
                           Timescales.            01/01/70 00:00      
                              There are short term effects too            01/01/70 00:00      
                        I am aware            01/01/70 00:00      
                           Obscure scientists            01/01/70 00:00      
                              Talking of carbon footprints            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 Pb-free            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    How it relates to global warming            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       re global warming            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       what???            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          Angry and scared.            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             Logic problem            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             Since you quoted me...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                Mandates ?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                   States rights            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                      And, and...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                         Revenue of course...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                nuclear?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                   ridiculous?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                      Not quite wasteless.            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                         Neutron activation            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                      this is not the case            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                         fusion is easy!!!!            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                   nuclear\'s not much better ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                      radiation            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          Hyperbole            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             the EPA            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       mentalist            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    consumerism            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       Cost of CO2 removal from a coal power plant            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          And that's exactly ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             Why babble about unnecessary inconveniences,            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                Why do you think nuclear is clean?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                   how much CO2 does it generate? ZERO            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                   recycling is automatic            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                Inconveniences.            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                not inconvenient for me            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                   what are you waiting for            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                      I think you misquoted me            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                         Nope            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                            Nonsense!            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                               Disagree            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                  What makes you so important?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                     Sigh            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                        Corruption            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                           The fish ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                        is this a "red herring"? "Everybody does it."            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                           Oh ok            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                              Where you sit determines what you see ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                 the top creature            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                    Russian 'imitation' cognac, I hope            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                       maybe inadequate translation?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                 Reasons            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                    Did you notice the jump in gasoline prices?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                       now we know what you reelly want            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                          hate to tell you this eric            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                             Tax            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                             What susidies?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                                consider the 1 mil/kilobuck ratio of oil-leases            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                             No subsidies            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                                You don't serously believe that, do you?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                                   Please            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                                   Oil companies?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                                      It's an accounting trick ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                                         Basis of opinion            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                                            agenda? no ... I just like to argue ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                                         re:taxes            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                                            They're just trying to make a buck.            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                                            Not manipulation, market            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                                               Reality vs. theory            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                                                  Close, but not quite.            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                                                     Hm .. ?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                                                        Not sure            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                                                           East of Fallon            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                                                           MPG            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                                                              maybe?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                                                           It\\\'s a bit hidden, but I found it ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                                                              Also            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                                                        Back Yards            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                                                     re:nimby            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                                                        Exxon            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                                               re:oil            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                                                  BP            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                                            So how big is your gas tank ?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                                               cheaper gas            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                                                  Good for you.            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                                                     OT - Octane rating            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                                                        Diesels ??            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                                                           Try imports.            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                                                           One's a truck...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                                                        I know.            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                                                           I somewhat recall - a long tim,e ago            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                          I once had a girlfriend ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                       Response            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                          If you\'re a gambling man ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                             Continuing on            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                             Yes, Richard, man is evil            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                                I can't remember that far back ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                 What do you see?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                               What corruption?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                  Those are all minor examples            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                         Automobiles "have at least one drawback"            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                            And all it took was ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                               Hindsight's always 20/20            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                  hindsight????            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                     but that's where the nuke debacles have occurred            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                         to Richard            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                            CPUs            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                            I knew that would come up ... ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                               You are beginning to scare me Richard            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                  I'm an animal lover            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                     yep ... me too ... and on an ATV at 1000 yards            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                  Yup ... there's only one animal I don't like ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                         Engineering 101...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                            That's what proves the fools are running things            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                               My point...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                  A few corrections ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          particularly since transport is the lion's share            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             Nature            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                Can you name ONE human act of benefit to the earth            01/01/70 00:00      
                              triangle, shmiangle            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             01/01/70 00:00      
                                    Daylight Savings            01/01/70 00:00      
               Oh, you ring a bell there            01/01/70 00:00      
                  Its only just becoming apparent            01/01/70 00:00      
         and what are these conditions?            01/01/70 00:00      
            Synthesis            01/01/70 00:00      
               the relationship between energy, money and ecology            01/01/70 00:00      
               also an interesting related wikipedia article            01/01/70 00:00      
         Hot ?            01/01/70 00:00      
         Geologist pokes his head in here...            01/01/70 00:00      
            Sci Fi            01/01/70 00:00      
               Read it back in college            01/01/70 00:00      
                  Freon            01/01/70 00:00      
                     Effects.            01/01/70 00:00      
                        re:freon            01/01/70 00:00      
                           Convection.            01/01/70 00:00      
                              Just like ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 Freon at the South Pole            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    Because ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                              re:convection            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 No studies ?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 This should show you guys ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    Disagree            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       We'll never know who's right            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          "Net benefit"            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          Right            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       The religion of economy.            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          So you theorize            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             Actually            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                Uhm            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             a noble thought, but            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                Save the starving            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             Data.            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                Ok, see above            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                   CoolBiz            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    Held off?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       I wouldn't worry            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          Big lies            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             "Natural"            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                Definition            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                   Heheh            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                   inorganic food            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                   Carbonaceous?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                It stems from human huberis            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             it's not self-loathing            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                Why ?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                   I wouldn\'t attribute that to \"fun\"            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                      Here pussy pussy            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                Speak for yourself, Richard            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                   When was the last time            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                      what is "environment"?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                         it is the same thing that people do            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                      Pre-historic oxygen levels            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                         Nature's balance            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                      not a bacteria, but            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       It's a religious issue for you gross-polluters            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       Nobody\'s going to switch sides ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          I know...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             Well, that wasn't my goal.            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                Another class            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                   You've been brainwashed!            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                      Vested interests            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                   Consequences ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                      Socialism            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                         It's time to reconsider.            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                            No evidence            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                               It's like I said ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                            echo            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                         Suspicions.            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                            Ok            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                            Two points            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                               Commons            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                  Commons            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                  Commons            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                     no            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                        Rabbits in Canada            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                           Population dynamics            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                     Tragedy of unregulated commons.            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                        Okay            01/01/70 00:00      
                     Freon            01/01/70 00:00      
                        Freon conspiracy            01/01/70 00:00      
   This just in...80% reduction needed...            01/01/70 00:00      
      worked too            01/01/70 00:00      
      I missed something            01/01/70 00:00      
         Iron in the ocean            01/01/70 00:00      
            Ocean anywhere            01/01/70 00:00      
               Iron inthe Oceans            01/01/70 00:00      
                  while it may have been in a book            01/01/70 00:00      
                     Try "SOFeX"            01/01/70 00:00      
                        Take up ?            01/01/70 00:00      
   Credit where credit is due...            01/01/70 00:00      
      Getting clse thoughe            01/01/70 00:00      
         Editorial control            01/01/70 00:00      
   the stupidest way to do things            01/01/70 00:00      
      Tax !            01/01/70 00:00      
         Somebody please throw some brains ...            01/01/70 00:00      
   the REAL problem            01/01/70 00:00      
      the people who brainwashed me can spell!            01/01/70 00:00      
         maybe not            01/01/70 00:00      
            They're behind on their washing ... and so am I            01/01/70 00:00      
               well this is TOTALLY off topic, but anyhow            01/01/70 00:00      
                  So you're a costco shopper too, eh?            01/01/70 00:00      

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