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02/15/08 18:57
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#150895 - Why would this be the case?
Responding to: ???'s previous message
Andy Neil said:
Craig Steiner said:
I believe reverse engineering for the purposes of establishing compatibility is allowed in the U.S.

But I don't think that should require reading the code; that should be established as a "black-box" exercise?

No. Why would that be the case?

IANAL, but IIRC, it's perfectly legal to read and study the competitor's product's code, as long as you don't copy it verbatim.

You might like it or not, this is the case. There are other ways to protect your intellectual property, in US you can patent an algorithm or a piece of code, if you like.

Also, there are perfectly legal reasons to read and study a competitor's product's code, for example to establish whether they committed copyright infringement or not.

Moreover, the world is NOT just an appendix on the U.S., whether you like it or not (and, Andy, you are supposed to be among those who DON'T like it ;-) )...

---

Since the times I am paid for embedded programming, I am trying to study these things - read protection and stuff. My first commercial program was stolen within a month and the competitor who stole it exhibited the product in the next booth to us on a local exhibition. They even did not bother to change the fonts on the photocopied texts. They knew very well that we could take no practical legal steps in these countries in those times (and I doubt we could nowadays - it takes too long to get a case to the court, which then takes even more to get to a final decision (several years, even decade sometimes, and there is little legal enforcement even if one wins a case). So the only way how to protect our IP is to use as much of the copy protection the chips offer as possible.

So, I NEED to know everything about copy protection, lock bits etc., to protect MY locked code and stuff. Also, I would like to see bigger pressure exerted to the manufacturers to move the "safer" technologies employed e.g. in smartcards, to the "everydays'" microcontrollers.

This is why I am HAPPY to see such discussions, and will continue to contribute to them links to general sources of knowledge on the topic, such as I did today, and maybe even more.

To try to pretend that there are no thieves makes absolutely no sense, nor does hiding the fact that most locks can be picked by simple tools (btw. do you know the classics "MIT Guide to Lockpicking"?)

JW


List of 71 messages in thread
TopicAuthorDate
Security-breaking threads            01/01/70 00:00      
   Mostly bad            01/01/70 00:00      
      put that in the rulse and ...            01/01/70 00:00      
   Reverse Engineering            01/01/70 00:00      
      Why would this be the case?            01/01/70 00:00      
         legal, maybe, but worthless            01/01/70 00:00      
      Reverse Engineering            01/01/70 00:00      
         locked doors            01/01/70 00:00      
            a couple of points ...            01/01/70 00:00      
               Thief?            01/01/70 00:00      
                  Ironically the Chinese Wall            01/01/70 00:00      
                  IANAL, but...            01/01/70 00:00      
                     Are you sure?            01/01/70 00:00      
                  the law can be interpreted in many ways            01/01/70 00:00      
               by the time you'll decide...            01/01/70 00:00      
                  the short happy life of ... Jan Waclawek?            01/01/70 00:00      
                     you apparently don't understand my point, Richard            01/01/70 00:00      
                        It should be how to Protect Your MCU rather then h            01/01/70 00:00      
                        perhaps I do            01/01/70 00:00      
                           Fair use, security, and all that            01/01/70 00:00      
                              It's simpler than that            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 What harm?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    If you really want to do that            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       A greater harm            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          Have you gone one assumption too far?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             Republicans, believe .... AIDS            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                mingling the issue            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                   Which link ?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                      find it yourself            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                         You find it and Its IAR policy not yours            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                            no, it is not, I'm sure            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                               what an IAR in code ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                  not witrh a Keil eval            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                     Thats company policy            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                        I sure can make this decision that            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                           Is leasing Compiler legal ? . I will never do that            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                              I don't quite understand this..            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                 That's why it requires no treatment here            01/01/70 00:00      
                           Would you?            01/01/70 00:00      
   Slap in the face!            01/01/70 00:00      
      Recovering lost code            01/01/70 00:00      
   Don't help pirates but...            01/01/70 00:00      
   FAQ            01/01/70 00:00      
   it sure is immoral to steal code            01/01/70 00:00      
      The morality of repairs.            01/01/70 00:00      
   I've done it legally and ...            01/01/70 00:00      
      Faulty logic            01/01/70 00:00      
         evidently you missed my exception            01/01/70 00:00      
            False statements            01/01/70 00:00      
               GPL as 'protection' LOL            01/01/70 00:00      
      Security through obscurity            01/01/70 00:00      
         other possibilities            01/01/70 00:00      
            Malund you come to conclusion very early !            01/01/70 00:00      
               Are you sure?            01/01/70 00:00      
                  OK, so let's circumvent this problem...            01/01/70 00:00      
               then why have you done so?            01/01/70 00:00      
                  Did that link open your eyes            01/01/70 00:00      
                     I do not care, my code is worthless in hex            01/01/70 00:00      
         This one is on you, Craig ... the buck stops there            01/01/70 00:00      
            Competence.            01/01/70 00:00      
               I know of many 'unteachable'            01/01/70 00:00      
                  That's what put options are for ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                     Let's not promote fakery in the profession            01/01/70 00:00      
   Answer to the original question            01/01/70 00:00      

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